Author Topic: 2008 Presidential Election  (Read 66390 times)

Online TheFang

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2012 Presidental Election? Palin Resigns as Gov. of Alaska.
« Reply #702 on: 07-03-2009, 10:49pm »
From the NYTimes...

Palin Resigning Governor’s Job; Future Unclear


By ADAM NAGOURNEY and JIM RUTENBERG

Gov. Sarah Palin of Alaska abruptly announced on Friday that she was quitting at the end of the month, shocking Republicans across the country and leaving both parties uncertain about whether she was leaving national politics or laying the groundwork for a presidential run.

Ms. Palin, 45, the Republican vice-presidential nominee last year, was supposed to serve through the end of 2010; she said she would cede control of the state to Lt. Gov. Sean Parnell on July 25.

Speaking outside her home in Wasilla, she offered conflicting signals about her intentions and her motivation.

In her tone and some of her words in an often-rambling announcement, Ms. Palin sounded like someone who was making a permanent exit from politics after what her friends have called a rough and dispiriting year.

But her remarks, delivered in a voice that often seemed rushed and jittery, sounded at times like those of a candidate with continued national aspirations, as when she suggested she could “fight for all our children’s future from outside the governor’s office.”

Ms. Palin said that she had decided not to seek re-election when her term expires at the end of next year and that, given that, she did not think it was fair to her constituents to continue in office.

“As I thought about this announcement that I would not seek re-election,” she said, “I thought about how much fun other governors have as lame ducks. They maybe travel around their state, travel to other states, maybe take their overseas international trade missions.”

“I’m not going to put Alaskans through that,” she said. “I promised efficiencies and effectiveness. That’s not how I’m wired. I’m not wired to operate under the same old politics as usual.”

The news conference came at the end of a week in which a Vanity Fair article about Ms. Palin brought renewed focus on many of the criticisms of her as a candidate for vice president under Senator John McCain and set off a new round of recriminations among Mr. McCain’s advisers about her competence.

But while Ms. Palin has been derided by much of the Republican Party elite, she remains extremely popular with many grass-roots members, especially social and religious conservatives.

Ms. Palin’s announcement was another unusual marker in what has been a tumultuous year for this first-term governor since Mr. McCain turned her into a national figure overnight by shocking his own party and naming her his running mate. It also underscored the instability within the Republican Party as it tries to find a strategy and voice in the wake of losses in 2008.

She made the announcement standing with her family. At one point she described how her children had voted in favor of her doing this — “Four yeses and one ‘Hell, yeah!’ ” she said — suggesting that the family had had enough of the scrutiny that has made them tabloid staples.

But at another point she invoked a military leader in what seemed to be an effort to wave aside any suggestion that she was abandoning the fight. “Take the words of General MacArthur,” she said. “He said, ‘We’re not retreating. We are advancing in another direction.’ “

Later in the afternoon, as questions reverberated around Republican circles about what exactly she intended to do, she posted a notice on her Twitter site, reading: “We’ll soon attach info on decision to not seek re-election ... This is in Alaska’s best interest, my family’s happy ... It is good, stay tuned.”

Ms. Palin is one of a number of Republican governors who are possible contenders for the party’s presidential nomination in 2012 whose terms expire in 2010.

Many Republican strategists have argued that it would be difficult for someone to run for governor in 2010 and turn around immediately, while running a state, and run for president in 2012. Gov. Tim Pawlenty of Minnesota announced last month that he would not seek re-election when his term expires in 2010, as he considers a race for president.

Quitting midterm, however, is highly unusual. It set off speculation about what led her to leave so abruptly. One interpretation among Republicans was that she had simply underscored how erratic she is as a politician.

“Good point guards don’t quit and walk off the floor if the going gets tough,” said John Weaver, a former senior strategist for Mr. McCain. “Today’s move falls further into the weirdness category; people don’t like a quitter.”

But some of her supporters argued that this could actually provide Ms. Palin an opportunity to recover from what has been a damaging year for her, and prepare herself for the 2012 race. She has been enmeshed in continuing battles with members of both parties in her Legislature.

The sheer distance of Alaska from the rest of the country complicated her ability to take care of the most basic kind of presidential preparation work: going to Republican Party dinners, developing a network of fund-raisers and supporters and becoming educated about the issues.

In addition, Ms. Palin just signed a lucrative contract to write a book.

“I think she is trying to determine how she can better get to where she’d like to be,” said Speaker Mike Chenault of the Alaska Legislature, a Republican from the Kenai Peninsula. “And she figures that if she resigns, people can’t be taking so many potshots at her.”

William Kristol, the editor of The Weekly Standard and a supporter of Ms. Palin, said that in the end, this could turn out to have been a smart move.

“Everybody I’ve talked to thinks it’s a little crazy,” Mr. Kristol said. “But maybe not. What is she going to accomplish in the next year as governor? Every time she left the state she got criticized for neglecting her duties.”

“She’ll take a little hit for leaving the job early, no question about it,” he said. “But if she writes this book and gives speeches and travels the country and educates herself on some issues, that’s good.”

The way Ms. Palin presented her decision seemed to leave open the possibility that she had been motivated by any one of a number of reasons, including being sick of politics and wanting to get out or taking pre-emptive action in anticipation of some embarrassing disclosure.

“It caught everybody by surprise,” said the former Alaska House majority leader, Ralph Samuels, a Republican who is contemplating a run for governor in 2010. “I’ve had a million calls today from friends, all political junkies, and everyone is asking the same questions: Is it national ambition, or does she want time to write the book, or is she just tired of it? Don’t have a clue.”

John Coale, a prominent trial lawyer and Democrat who helped Ms. Palin create her political action committee, said in an interview that he had been given no advance word of her decision.

“She didn’t even tell her brother,” Mr. Coale added.

Mr. Coale said he had spoken to Ms. Palin’s husband, Todd. “And he’s like, they’re not sure what they are going to do from here on out, but they’re sure they don’t want to do this,” he said.

Andrew Halcro, a former Republican state legislator who ran against Ms. Palin as an independent in 2006, said, “From a purely logical standpoint, this doesn’t make sense.” As governor, Mr. Halcro said, Ms. Palin had the standing to still be in the news.

“She had 16 months to score some points getting some policy wins and showing she’s a leader,” he said.

If there was widespread shock over Ms. Palin’s decision in Alaska, there was also widespread acknowledgement that she had political problems that were hobbling her in office. Lyda Green, a Republican and former president of the Alaska Senate who is from Ms. Palin’s hometown and who counted herself a friend until a falling out in recent years, said she took the announcement as tacit confirmation that Ms. Palin was running for president.

“The longer she stays in, the more people become disenchanted and see something they hadn’t seen before,” Ms. Green said. “This has been a pretty precipitous fall.”

"I can't help it, I'm a greedy slob. It's my hobby." -- D.D.

Offline duke_of_earl

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Re: 2008 Presidential Election
« Reply #701 on: 11-29-2008, 07:56am »
To the victors go the spoils!  I actually saw this on TV...

duke

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Offline jcpeace

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Re: 2008 Presidential Election
« Reply #700 on: 11-10-2008, 11:09am »
However, someone needs to whisper into the imperator's ear that he is mortal, even while the crowd throws garlands.  I don't feel comfortable anymore that within this community there is a lot of space for dissent or questioning or disagreeing anymore- or that when people do this there is an automatic assumption of bad faith.

This jacobinism is what has been the ugliest element of Rovian triumphalism for the last eight years.  The republicans never used to be like that (viz. Bush the elder or Reagan). It's created a GOP with no space for people like me. I see it arising outside the GOP, and indeed outside political parties, and this is sad.

resistance is futile, foreigner....... >:D
we will be dispatching a crack re-education duo to assist you in the transition process.
expect them to show up on your doorstep in a week or 2.  ;)
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Offline nikki

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Re: 2008 Presidential Election
« Reply #699 on: 11-10-2008, 09:37am »
Is just one national holiday enough?

duke

I am only in support of new holidays that come with a day off.

Offline duke_of_earl

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Re: 2008 Presidential Election
« Reply #698 on: 11-10-2008, 09:12am »
Is just one national holiday enough?

duke

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Planning under way for Obama holiday
The Capital-Journal
Published Sunday, November 09, 2008

Plans are being made to promote a national holiday for Barack Obama, who will become the nation's 44th president when he takes the oath of office Jan. 20.

"Yes We Can" planning rallies will be at 7 a.m. and 7 p.m. every Tuesday at the downtown McDonald's restaurant, 1100 Kansas Ave., until Jan. 13. The goals are to secure a national holiday in Obama's honor, to organize celebrations around his inauguration and to celebrate the 200th birthday of President Abraham Lincoln, who was born on Feb. 12 1809.
Print E-mail Comment

At 7:30 a.m. on Inauguration Day, Obama Cake will be served at the downtown McDonald's, and a celebration is scheduled for 8 p.m. to midnight Jan. 20 at the Ramada Hotel and Convention Center, 420 S.E. 6th.

Offline justiceiro

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Re: 2008 Presidential Election
« Reply #697 on: 11-09-2008, 05:36am »
All comedy routines aside, when McCain chose Sarah Palin as his running mate he basically said to the American people that he was to incompetent to lead. This woman is barely educated, has virtually no knowledge of the world outside of her state and is completely disengaged, intellectually. Coming from a family of competent female public servants, this was just so cynical and so insulting! And look at how the intellectuals of the GOP responded: they left in dROVES.

I'm pretty sure that the American people have seen enough incompetent governance over the last 8 years....and look where it got us.

I can draw the line between ideology and competency....what about you Mccain supporters? Reagan, for the most part surrounded himself with competent people, as did Bush Sr. (with the exception of Quayle, of course). 

Is good governance a concern for you McCain supporters? Or is it all about ideology? Enlighten me....please!


Despite the fact that I have an entirely different political point of view than you, jcp, I agree with your assessment of what the choice of Palin meant, and it was this more than anything else that convinced me not to vote for McCain.  I never thought that McCain was a Bush clone, or even close.  But Palin seems to be cut from the same cloth, and yes, competency is a paramount issue.  His choice of her was bad, in of itself, because she is pretty awful, and it indicates that the stress of the campaign was beginning to cause him to unravel.  It was then that I first began to worry about his age- it would have been a serious possibility that he could have died in office- and where would that leave us?  Palin as president was unacceptable.

I think it's a good thing to hope for the best.  I certainly do, and it's also appropriate to point out that Obama represents a wonderful opportunity to move away from the past eight years.  However, someone needs to whisper into the imperator's ear that he is mortal, even while the crowd throws garlands.  I don't feel comfortable anymore that within this community there is a lot of space for dissent or questioning or disagreeing anymore- or that when people do this there is an automatic assumption of bad faith.

This jacobinism is what has been the ugliest element of Rovian triumphalism for the last eight years.  The republicans never used to be like that (viz. Bush the elder or Reagan). It's created a GOP with no space for people like me. I see it arising outside the GOP, and indeed outside political parties, and this is sad.
« Last Edit: 11-09-2008, 08:22am by MCA »
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Online TheFang

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Offline Soshin

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Re: 2008 Presidential Election
« Reply #695 on: 11-08-2008, 08:30am »
:rofl: 

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/v/SQVP2BV9LP0&amp;hl=en&amp;fs=1" target="_blank" class="new_win">http://www.youtube.com/v/SQVP2BV9LP0&amp;hl=en&amp;fs=1</a>
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Offline jennymayla

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Re: 2008 Presidential Election
« Reply #694 on: 11-07-2008, 07:21pm »
This is long but if you don't feel moved by this, regardless of your political preference, you are a lost soul...


A Butler Well Served by This Election
For 34 Years, Eugene Allen Carried White House Trays With Pride. Now There's Even More Reason to Carry Himself That Way.

By Wil Haygood
Washington Post Staff Writer
Friday, November 7, 2008; A01

For more than three decades Eugene Allen worked in the White House, a black man unknown to the headlines. During some of those years, harsh segregation laws lay upon the land.

He trekked home every night, his wife, Helene, keeping him out of her kitchen.

At the White House, he worked closer to the dirty dishes than to the large desk in the Oval Office. Helene didn't care; she just beamed with pride.

President Truman called him Gene.

President Ford liked to talk golf with him.

He saw eight presidential administrations come and go, often working six days a week. "I never missed a day of work," Allen says.

His is a story from the back pages of history. A figure in the tiniest of print. The man in the kitchen.

He was there while America's racial history was being remade: Brown v. Board of Education, the Little Rock school crisis, the 1963 March on Washington, the cities burning, the civil rights bills, the assassinations.

When he started at the White House in 1952, he couldn't even use the public restrooms when he ventured back to his native Virginia. "We had never had anything," Allen, 89, recalls of black America at the time. "I was always hoping things would get better."

In its long history, the White House -- just note the name -- has had a complex and vexing relationship with black Americans.

"The history is not so uneven at the lower level, in the kitchen," says Ted Sorensen, who served as counselor to President Kennedy. "In the kitchen, the folks have always been black. Even the folks at the door -- black."

Sorensen tried to address the matter of blacks in the White House. But in the end, there was only one black man who stayed on the executive staff at the Kennedy White House past the first year. "There just weren't as many blacks as there should have been," says Sorensen. "Sensitivities weren't what they should have been, or could have been."

In 1866 the abolitionist Frederick Douglass, sensing an opening to advocate for black voting rights, made a White House visit to lobby President Andrew Johnson. Johnson refused to engage in a struggle for black voting rights. Douglass was back at the White House in 1877. But no one wished to discuss his political sentiments: President Rutherford Hayes had engaged the great man -- it was a time of high minstrelsy across the nation -- to serve as a master of ceremonies for an evening of entertainment.

In the fall of 1901, another famous black American came to the door. President Theodore Roosevelt invited Booker T. Washington, head of the Tuskegee Institute, to meet with him at the White House. Roosevelt was careful not to announce the invitation, fearing a backlash, especially from Southerners. But news of the visit leaked quickly enough and the uproar was swift and noisy. In an editorial, the Memphis Scimitar would write in the ugly language of the times: "It is only recently that President Roosevelt boasted that his mother was a Southern woman, and that he is half Southern by reason of that fact. By inviting a nigger to his table he pays his mother small duty."

Fifty years later, invitations to the White House were still fraught with racial subtext. When the Daughters of the American Revolution refused to allow pianist Hazel Scott to perform at Constitution Hall because of her race, many letters poured into the White House decrying the DAR's position. First lady Bess Truman was a member of the organization, but she made no effort to get the DAR to alter its policy. Scott's husband, Harlem congressman Adam Clayton Powell, subsequently referred to Bess Truman as "the last lady of the land." The words outraged President Truman, who vowed to aides he would find some way to punish Powell and barred the fellow Democrat from setting foot inside the Truman White House.

The first black to hold a policy or political position in the White House was E. Frederick Morrow, a former public relations executive with CBS. Gen. Dwight Eisenhower's presidential campaign operatives were so impressed with Morrow's diligent work during the 1952 campaign that they promised him a White House executive job if Ike were elected. Ike won, but Morrow ended up being placed at the Department of Commerce. He felt slighted and appealed to Republican friends in New York to force the White House to make good on its promise.

The phone finally rang in 1955 and Morrow was named administrative officer for special projects. He had hoped the title would give him wide responsibilities inside the White House, but found himself dealing, for the most part, with issues related to the Brown desegregation ruling, the Rosa Parks-led bus boycott in Montgomery, Ala., and the 1957 Little Rock school crisis.

"He was a man of great dignity," says Stephen Hess, senior fellow emeritus at the Brookings Institution, who worked as a speechwriter for Eisenhower. Morrow was in a lonely position, but "he did not complain," says Hess. "That wasn't Fred Morrow."

When Morrow left his White House position, he imagined there'd be corporate job offers. There were not. "Only thing he was offered were jobs related to the black community," says Hess. Nonetheless, "after Morrow, it was appropriate to have a black person on the staff of the White House."

'Pantry Man'
Before he landed his job at the White House, Gene Allen worked as a waiter at the Homestead resort in Hot Springs, Va., and then at a country club in Washington.

He and wife Helene, 86, are sitting in the living room of their home off Georgia Avenue NW. A cane rests across her lap. Her voice is musical, in a Lena Horne kind of way. She calls him "honey." They met in Washington at a birthday party in 1942. He was too shy to ask for her number, so she tracked his down. They married a year later.

In 1952, a lady told him of a job opening in the White House. "I wasn't even looking for a job," he says. "I was happy where I was working, but she told me to go on over there and meet with a guy by the name of Alonzo Fields."

Fields was a maitre d', and he immediately liked Allen.

Allen was offered a job as a "pantry man." He washed dishes, stocked cabinets and shined silverware. He started at $2,400 a year.

There was, in time, a promotion to butler. "Shook the hand of all the presidents I ever worked for," he says.

"I was there, honey," Helene reminds. "In the back, maybe. But I shook their hands, too." She's referring to White House holiday parties, Easter egg hunts. They have one son, Charles. He works as an investigator with the State Department.

"President Ford's birthday and my birthday were on the same day," he says. "He'd have a birthday party at the White House. Everybody would be there. And Mrs. Ford would say, 'It's Gene's birthday, too!' "

And so they'd sing a little ditty to the butler. And the butler, who wore a tuxedo to work every day, would blush.

"Jack Kennedy was very nice," he goes on. "And so was Mrs. Kennedy."

"Hmm-mmm," she says, rocking.

He was in the White House kitchen the day JFK was slain. He got a personal invitation to the funeral. But he volunteered for other duty: "Somebody had to be at the White House to serve everyone after they came from the funeral."

The whole family of President Jimmy Carter made her chuckle: "They were country. And I'm talking Lillian and Rosalynn both." It comes out sounding like the highest compliment.

First lady Nancy Reagan came looking for him in the kitchen one day. She wanted to remind him about the upcoming dinner for West German Chancellor Helmut Kohl. He told her he was well ahead in the planning and had already picked out the china. But she told him he would not be working that night.

"She said, 'You and Helene are coming to the state dinner as guests of President Reagan and myself.' I'm telling you! I believe I'm the only butler to get invited to a state dinner."

Husbands and wives don't sit together at these events, and Helene was nervous about trying to make small talk with world leaders. "And my son says, 'Mama, just talk about your high school. They won't know the difference.'

"The senators were all talking about the colleges and universities that they went to," she says." I was doing as much talking as they were.

"Had champagne that night," she says, looking over at her husband.

He just grins: He was the man who stacked the champagne at the White House.

Moving Up, but Slowly
President Kennedy, who succeeded Eisenhower, started with two blacks, Frank Reeves and Andrew Hatcher, in executive positions on his White House staff. Only Hatcher, a deputy press secretary, remained after six months. Reeves, who focused on civil rights matters, left in a political reshuffling.

The issue of race bedeviled this White House, even amid good intentions. In February 1963, Kennedy invited 800 blacks to the White House to commemorate the 100th anniversary of the Emancipation Proclamation. Louis Martin, a Democratic operative who helped plan the function, had placed the names of entertainer Sammy Davis Jr. and his wife, May Britt, on the guest list. The White House scratched it off and Martin would put it back on. According to Martin, Kennedy was aghast when he saw the black and white couple stroll into the White House. His face reddened and he instructed photographers that no pictures of the interracial couple would be taken.

But Sammy Davis Jr. was not finished with 1600 Pennsylvania Ave. He got himself invited to the Nixon White House to meet with the president and talk about Vietnam and business opportunities for blacks. He even slept in the Lincoln Bedroom once. When Davis sang at the 1972 Republican convention in Miami, he famously wrapped his arms around Nixon at a youth rally there, becoming forever identified with a White House that many blacks found hostile.

Lyndon Johnson devoted considerable energy and determination to civil rights legislation, even appointing the first black to the Supreme Court. But it did not translate to any appreciable number of blacks working on his staff. Clifford Alexander says he was the sole black in Johnson's White House, serving first as a National Security Council officer, then as associate White House counsel.

"We were fighting for something quite new," says Alexander. "You knew how much your job meant. And you knew President Johnson was fighting on your behalf." As a young man growing up in Harlem, Alexander had heard about Morrow. Mothers and fathers pointed to him as a grand success story. "Fred was a lovely man," says Alexander. "But they did not pay any attention to him in the Eisenhower White House."

Colin Powell would become the highest-ranking black of any White House to that point when he was named President Reagan's national security adviser in 1987. Condoleezza Rice would have that same position under President George W. Bush.

The butler remembers seeing both Powell and Rice in the Oval Office. He was serving refreshments. He couldn't help notice that blacks were moving closer to the center of power, closer than he could ever have dreamed. He'd tell Helene how proud it made him feel.

Time for Change
Gene Allen was promoted to maitre d' in 1980. He left the White House in 1986, after 34 years. President Reagan wrote him a sweet note. Nancy Reagan hugged him, tight.

Interviewed at their home last week, Gene and Helene speculated about what it would mean if a black man were actually elected president.

"Just imagine," she said.

"It'd be really something," he said.

"We're pretty much past the going-out stage," she said. "But you never know. If he gets in there, it'd sure be nice to go over there again."

They've got pictures of President and Mrs. Reagan in the living room. On a wall in the basement, they've got pictures of every president Gene ever served. There's a painting President Eisenhower gave him and a picture of President Ford opening birthday gifts, Gene hovering nearby.

They talked about praying to help Barack Obama get to the White House. They'd go vote together. She'd lean on her cane with one hand, and on him with the other, while walking down to the precinct. And she'd get supper going afterward. They'd gone over their Election Day plans more than once.

"Imagine," she said.

"That's right," he said.

On Monday Helene had a doctor's appointment. Gene woke and nudged her once, then again. He shuffled around to her side of the bed. He nudged Helene again. He was all alone.

"I woke up and my wife didn't," he said later.

Some friends and family members rushed over. He wanted to make coffee. They had to shoo the butler out of the kitchen.

The lady whom he married 65 years ago will be buried today.

The butler cast his vote for Obama on Tuesday. He so missed telling his Helene about the black man bound for the Oval Office.


Click here to see the photo gallery:  http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/11/06/AR2008110603948.html?nav=emailpage&sid=ST2008110604101&s_pos=
« Last Edit: 11-07-2008, 07:29pm by jennymayla »

Offline AmbushBug

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Re: 2008 Presidential Election
« Reply #693 on: 11-06-2008, 11:56pm »
To :

How absolutely right you are, and what a great post to break your 666 limit. Though change was the term Obama chose to base his message around, McCain lost (with 8 years of help from the GOP) because by comparison Obama's real differentiator was competence—or at least his lack of incompetence.
A particularly Jersey malaise—the inextinguishable longing for elsewheres.

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Offline duke_of_earl

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Re: 2008 Presidential Election
« Reply #692 on: 11-06-2008, 11:45pm »
This seems to be a serious problem:

duke
<a href="http://www.theonion.com/content/themes/common/assets/videoplayer/flvplayer.swf" target="_blank" class="new_win">http://www.theonion.com/content/themes/common/assets/videoplayer/flvplayer.swf</a>

(if the embed isn't working....)
http://www.theonion.com/content//node/89632?utm_source=embedded_video_2

Offline super_furry

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Re: 2008 Presidential Election
« Reply #691 on: 11-06-2008, 03:02pm »
The sweet smell of victory - from a FOX affiliate

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/v/BUo0_uTGRuE&amp;color1=0xb1b1b1&amp;color2=0xcfcfcf&amp;fs=1" target="_blank" class="new_win">http://www.youtube.com/v/BUo0_uTGRuE&amp;color1=0xb1b1b1&amp;color2=0xcfcfcf&amp;fs=1</a>

I believe in kama

Online Frank M

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Re: 2008 Presidential Election
« Reply #690 on: 11-06-2008, 01:15pm »
That's certainly been my take on the campaign and election, but I'm more interested in human behavior than politics.


You think incorrectly, as we cannot agree on your assessment of the election in the binary terms you present.

My concern and the reason I point this out is because this election was, I think we can agree, as much if not moreso a REJECTION of the previous administration rather than an embrace of left-wing Democratic party policy.

Of course you haven't seen any crowing or action from the left about a mandate- they haven't taken office as a body yet.

My comment to elgoodo was not, in fact, a STFU but rather, wondering aloud why at a time I would think he'd be in a celebratory mood, he's still sour-grapey.

Offline elgoodo

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Re: 2008 Presidential Election
« Reply #689 on: 11-06-2008, 01:05pm »
Thank you jcpeace.
[06:11 PM]  fasteddie: jesus, this SB is deader than JC Vibe

Offline jcpeace

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Re: 2008 Presidential Election
« Reply #688 on: 11-06-2008, 01:02pm »
My concern and the reason I point this out is because this election was, I think we can agree, as much if not moreso a REJECTION of the previous administration rather than an embrace of left-wing Democratic party policy.


I'm not sure how one defines a mandate....but Obama won just about every key demographic group on tuesday nite. That says a great deal to me.

And as far as what voters were rejecting or embracing, that's a tough call.

Speaking for myself, this was not an ideological choice. You all know that my personal politics are all over the place on some issues, but very firmly on the far left on most.....way to the left of Obama and the DNC. But did I vote for Cynthia Mckinney? Hell No!


What I was accepting with my vote for Obama, was the very distinct possibility of competent governance in his administration. What was I rejecting?: my own ideological narcissism and expectations that the world must conform to it.

All comedy routines aside, when McCain chose Sarah Palin as his running mate he basically said to the American people that he was to incompetent to lead. This woman is barely educated, has virtually no knowledge of the world outside of her state and is completely disengaged, intellectually. Coming from a family of competent female public servants, this was just so cynical and so insulting! And look at how the intellectuals of the GOP responded: they left in dROVES.

I'm pretty sure that the American people have seen enough incompetent governance over the last 8 years....and look where it got us.

I can draw the line between ideology and competency....what about you Mccain supporters? Reagan, for the most part surrounded himself with competent people, as did Bush Sr. (with the exception of Quayle, of course). 

Is good governance a concern for you McCain supporters? Or is it all about ideology? Enlighten me....please!

Quote

With all due respect back, I didn't have a candidate I identified with as closely or strongly.

same here......but i'm not looking for a mirror image of me when i vote. I just want competent governance at this pivotal stage of the game.
« Last Edit: 11-06-2008, 01:06pm by jcpeace »
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Offline jennymayla

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Re: 2008 Presidential Election
« Reply #687 on: 11-06-2008, 12:57pm »
With all due respect back, I didn't have a candidate I identified with as closely or strongly.

In fact, I never liked either of these candidates.

So the only separation, for me, is that of the essentially candidate-less voter- which was my point from very early on in this thread.

I would suggest that this is a chance for people to experience the enthusiasm and hope around the President-elect and suspend cynicism and doubt, just for a little while.  Because it's happening with or without you (not you you but you get it), and it is destined to be one of the most important and exciting times in modern day history.

I feel like this is a time of tremendous hope and potential.  For everyone.

Offline bdlaw

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Re: 2008 Presidential Election
« Reply #686 on: 11-06-2008, 12:49pm »
With all due respect back, I didn't have a candidate I identified with as closely or strongly.

In fact, I never liked either of these candidates.

So the only separation, for me, is that of the essentially candidate-less voter- which was my point from very early on in this thread.
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Offline jennymayla

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Re: 2008 Presidential Election
« Reply #685 on: 11-06-2008, 12:44pm »
My comment to elgoodo was not, in fact, a STFU but rather, wondering aloud why at a time I would think he'd be in a celebratory mood, he's still sour-grapey.

My question, with all due respect, is why you would be so quick to interpret it as sour-grapiness.


I also take issue with your use of the term "your candidate" which in and of itself perpetuates the separation that "your" own (apparent) candidate asked us to overlook. 
« Last Edit: 11-06-2008, 12:49pm by jennymayla »

Offline NON

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Re: 2008 Presidential Election
« Reply #684 on: 11-06-2008, 12:31pm »
You think incorrectly, as we cannot agree on your assessment of the election in the binary terms you present.

My concern and the reason I point this out is because this election was, I think we can agree, as much if not moreso a REJECTION of the previous administration rather than an embrace of left-wing Democratic party policy.

Of course you haven't seen any crowing or action from the left about a mandate- they haven't taken office as a body yet.

My comment to elgoodo was not, in fact, a STFU but rather, wondering aloud why at a time I would think he'd be in a celebratory mood, he's still sour-grapey.

Offline elgoodo

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Re: 2008 Presidential Election
« Reply #683 on: 11-06-2008, 12:29pm »
My concern and the reason I point this out is because this election was, I think we can agree, as much if not moreso a REJECTION of the previous administration rather than an embrace of left-wing Democratic party policy.

Of course you haven't seen any crowing or action from the left about a mandate- they haven't taken office as a body yet.

My comment to elgoodo was not, in fact, a STFU but rather, wondering aloud why at a time I would think he'd be in a celebratory mood, he's still sour-grapey.

I am not sour-grapey at all.  I am simply a little protective of our victory against those who might attempt to discredit it.
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Offline bdlaw

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Re: 2008 Presidential Election
« Reply #682 on: 11-06-2008, 12:25pm »
My concern and the reason I point this out is because this election was, I think we can agree, as much if not moreso a REJECTION of the previous administration rather than an embrace of left-wing Democratic party policy.

Of course you haven't seen any crowing or action from the left about a mandate- they haven't taken office as a body yet.

My comment to elgoodo was not, in fact, a STFU but rather, wondering aloud why at a time I would think he'd be in a celebratory mood, he's still sour-grapey.
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Offline NON

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Re: 2008 Presidential Election
« Reply #681 on: 11-06-2008, 12:23pm »
Personally I don't think even a 6% spread in the popular vote equals a mandate but then again I also dislike the electoral college system.

I read the rest of your post an acknowledgment that there is no such thing as a mandate anymore.  I would posit that is the case due to most Americans being centrists and not interested in handing too much power to either side of the aisle (the so-called "40 yards in the middle").

I would agree with your reading of the rest of my post. I haven't heard as much crowing from the left about having a mandate based on the outcome of this week, but there's been plenty of crowing from the right about Obama not having a mandate, whatever a mandate means, so as to undermine the legitimacy of the victory. Which is, of course, all they really have left in their political arsenal at this very moment.

Offline NON

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Re: 2008 Presidential Election
« Reply #680 on: 11-06-2008, 12:19pm »
elgoodo-

It's 2008.

Your candidate won.

Be happy.

loosely translated: STFU and get over it.

:rofl:

Offline bdlaw

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Re: 2008 Presidential Election
« Reply #679 on: 11-06-2008, 12:18pm »
Personally I don't think even a 6% spread in the popular vote equals a mandate but then again I also dislike the electoral college system.

I read the rest of your post an acknowledgment that there is no such thing as a mandate anymore.  I would posit that is the case due to most Americans being centrists and not interested in handing too much power to either side of the aisle (the so-called "40 yards in the middle").
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Offline bdlaw

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Re: 2008 Presidential Election
« Reply #678 on: 11-06-2008, 12:15pm »
elgoodo-

It's 2008.

Your candidate won.

Be happy.
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RB: i rubbed mine last night to be ready for tonight

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Re: 2008 Presidential Election
« Reply #678 on: 11-06-2008, 12:15pm »